Anthony Phillip (Tony) MATTHEWS

Interviewer: Morag Forrester

Date of interview: 10 September 2008

Tape I Side A

005: States he is ANTHONY PHILLIP COLIN MATTHEWS, born in 1944. He adds that his FATHER was JOHN ROBERT CHARLES MATTHEWS who emigrated from ENGLAND at the age of nineteen, starting out in KAIKOURA.

015: Goes on to say that his paternal GRANDFATHER, who was a church minister, died suddenly, leaving his estate to both sons. This, he adds, allowed his FATHER to buy a small property at SEFTON near RANGIORA.

021: Mentions that his PARENTS met in KAIKOURA - his MOTHER was ROSA BOYD and together they built their home at SEFTON, which was mainly a DAIRY FARM. "He milked COWS there for about fifty-four years."

027: Says he has an older BROTHER, (GEOFFREY), who after gaining FARM WORK experience on various rural properties around the SOUTH ISLAND, decided to lease their FATHER'S FARM

033. Preferring SHEEP to COWS, he says he spent school holidays helping out an UNCLE on his FARM near MOSSBURN.

037: Replies that he was educated at SEFTON PRIMARY and RANGIORA HIGH SCHOOL where he gained his leaving certificate at the age of seventeen.

044: It was in his early teens that he began helping out at the MOSSBURN property. "I just enjoyed the dogs. ..and the SHEEP rather fascinated me because you could tip them upside down, shear them (laughs)... .1 enjoyed beef CATTLE very much, but I didn't want the day-to-day slog of milking them." 054: His UNCLE in MOSSBURN was COLIN BOYD whose FARM was on the HAMILTON BURN ROAD, west of the township. Says that just after the boom in WOOL EXPORTS from NEW ZEALAND (c. 1954/55), FARMERS were able to purchase new machinery and borrow on their equity to invest in more land.

076: As a result, he says, he worked some long days on the TRACTOR as well as SHEARING "there was just so much more to do".

081: When he left school, he says, his first job was on a neighbouring FARM to his UNCLE'S in MOSSBURN. It was owned by GEORGE RUDDENKLAU at CASTLEROCK. At #132, he says the 700-acre FARM was mixed STOCK/CROP with about 1,000 EWES.

095 Considers that the MOSSBURN/LUMSDEN area was more remote in the late 1950s than in 2008 since during the intervening years there has been more subdivision of land, particularly around the townships. He later added that the advent of television and improvements in TV reception/coverage was a "fantastic development”.

099: Recalls the journey from RANGIORA to MOSSBURN was by steam train "and they used to put an extra engine on to come through from OAMARU to DUNEDIN because of the hills (and the tunnels through them). And when you came out at DUNEDIN... (it was) fun to look in the mirror 'cause your face would be as black as from all the soot off the two engines.. .everybody had a black face when they arrived."

106: From DUNEDIN, he says, he boarded another train to GORE from where his UNCLE collected him and they went by road to MOSSBURN.

116: Since he only had the job at RUDDENKLAU'S for a few months, he says he got his next job through playing RUGBY FOOTBALL. By deciding to play for the MOSSBURN junior team rather than its LUMSDEN rival, he secured a job with the team coach.

122: The average wage for a SHEPHERD in the early 1960s, he says, was £6/week plus board. Every FARM, he says, had MARRIED COUPLES (a term used when the wife was expected to work as a domestic help while the husband was hired as a FARM LABOURER). On bigger properties (more than 1500 EWES) a SINGLE MAN was also hired as an extra FARMHAND.

132: Comments on changing methods within a relatively short period of fifteen years by saying that when he moved onto his own FARM, STOCKED with 2000 EWES plus CATTLE, there was no extra help

141: Replies that he worked for about nine months on the MOSSBURN FARM until he sustained a knee injury in a tractor accident. The injury took a while to mend, which prompted him to study for a DIPLOMA in AGRICULTURE at LINCOLN COLLEGE. It involved six months of study followed by practical experience.

164: Continues that he got a placement on a MIXED/CROPPING FARM at DARFIELD, west of CHRISTCHURCH. While there, his exam results came through showing that he had not passed the theory. Having got "sick of classrooms" and with a fully recovered knee, he decided to stay on at the DARFIELD FARM and worked there for a further four years.

173. The FARM bred STUD SHEEP so that "each individual SHEEP became fairly well known and there was a lot of individual work with the animals rather than the flock system". In addition, with the recording and tagging of LAMBS and SIRES as well as RAM FAIRS, he remembers it as being interesting work with all the extra fine tuning.

179: On the CROPPING side, he says it was very intensive — they under sowed WHEAT with WHITE CLOVER. The former was harvested that year while the latter was harvested a year later. The paddock was ploughed up and planted with BARLEY and other crops such as PEAS or RYEGRASS.

183: After four years, he says, he was keen for a change. He also described the DARFIELD work as a "young man's occupation" because it was very intensive and involved having to work flat out just to keep ahead.

194: However, he estimates that it was as hard then for a young person to get a FARM as it is in 2008. "You had to have.. substantial family money.. .to be able to put a down payment on land in those days."

206: As for the social life of a young FARMER in DARFIELD, he says it revolved around the (AGRICULTURAL) shows - a type of showcase for local producers as well as a chance to network and socialise, especially as a dance was usually held to round off each district 's annual event.

214: "They were great days. ..great days to be young and single."

215: Mentions that he met his WIFE, JUDITH (née GOUGH) through the local network in DARFIELD because her FATHER owned a FARM situated less than a mile from the one on which he worked.

223: Says that before he met JUDY, she had already started working full-time at her MOTHER'S FLORIST shop in CHRISTCHURCH and often stayed in town during the week.

225: However, it was the local tennis club that proved matchmaker after he was invited to join the 'B' team. On one occasion, he recalls, he was asked to collect another team player in his car on the way to a match. "It turned out to be JUDITH.. .I think we went out to one of these show dances that night."

236: Replies that their courtship lasted about four years before they were MARRIED. In that time, he says, his boss suggested he apply for an advertised job as FARM MANAGER of an estate at OMIHI, AMBERLEY. "I got JUDITH to come along to the interview, too."

260: Says he got the job but "had to bach" for the first ten months since their wedding was not until the DECEMBER of that year (1968). Laughs that he'd not had to cook much for himself before then. "You were that hungry at night you didn't throw much out even if you had overcooked it or undercooked it."

266: Their WEDDING took place on 7/DECEMBER/1968 after which they went on honeymoon and returned to OMIHI where they stayed for the next four years during which time they had started a FAMILY. The eldest DAUGHTER, HELEN, was born in 1970 followed by JANE in 1972.

286: After about four years, he says, he and JUDY were both still keen to have their own FARM but it was difficult to get a foothold in the area in which they were based. So they were prepared to look further afield.

294: "I knew about the BALLOT FARMS coming up (under the government 's farm development schemes aimed at helping [mainly young/ people acquire their first FARM: see accompanying page - LAND DEVELOPMENT BLOCKS) and that seemed to be about our best option." He added that because it was a government-run scheme, a successful BALLOT-holder only required a small amount of cash as initial down payment to buy a fully economical FARM.

300: Says he knew nothing about the TE ANAU BASIN at the time, except that it was "very remote". He adds that he'd heard some of the SHEPHERDS and FARM WORKERS who were employed by the LANDS & SURVEY DEPT had set out to eventually enter the BALLOT system, but after a few years decided they could make more money staying on as workers rather than struggling with a new FARM.

308: Drought, he says, had also been a problem for the very first SETTLERS (eg. on the TAKITIMU BLOCK which was the first to be developed and settled upon in April 1962).

312: However, after OMIHI, he and JUDY decided on another FARM MANAGER' S job at PARAWA, which was of NOKOMA1 STATION, near ATHOL. He says it was mainly a finishing FARM for fattening LAMBS and STEERS ready for market. They were there for just over two years.

326. Mentions that their third CHILD and eldest SON, IAN, was born in 1976, two months after they'd moved onto their own property in the KAKAPO RD area and was followed by MARK in 1981.

330: Affirms that they successfully drew the BALLOT for LONG VALLEY BLOCK 'N' in DECEMBER 1975.

332 In explaining how the BALLOT system operated, he starts by saying that around NOVEMBER of each year newspaper listings were advertised indicating the number, type and location of the LANDS & SURVEY developed FARMS were ready for settlement. Applications to join the BALLOT were sought. A potential applicant then discussed with a STOCK FIRM or a BANK the possibility of securing financial backing for "seasonal finance".

350: The criteria for becoming a potential BALLOT-HOLDER, he says, was quite strict. For example, if an applicant could clearly gain financial support from family money to buy his own FARM, he would not be eligible. Nor would a SHEARER qualify, although some part-time SHEARERS had also worked as general FARMHANDS. "It was there for hardworking young couples... you had to have been working on land."

357: If an applicant got thus far, the next stage was for the STOCK AGENCY to arrange a tour of all the advertised FARMS on the different BLOCKS. "And then you often came back again with your wife." By a certain date, an application, including a list of properties in preferential order, had to be submitted to L&S.

362 The next stage, he says, was an interview to discuss various aspects of the application to establish whether or not each BALLOT-HOLDER was suitably qualified to start up a new FARM.

368 As far as LONG VALLEY 'N' was concerned, he says it was their first choice of a group of FARMS on the one subdivided BLOCK.

377: Describes how all the participants and officials were assembled in one room (in INVERCARGILL) and each couple's name was read out and they were given a marble with a number on it. This was fed into a barrel (similar to the popular-LOTTERY system seen on TV). "We were No. 8."

381: The barrel, which was positioned on a table, was spun and when it came to rest one of the marbles was randomly picked. "Marble No. 22, I think was the first one.. .and that wasn't us. And then they spun it again and marble No. 8 came out. And of course you could a heard a pin drop. And I was a bit embarrassed and I didn't move a muscle, I just froze."

384: Goes on to say that JUDITH nudged him to say that it was theirs and he still wanted to play it down. "Because at the end of it. ..an awful lot of emotion came out. There were people who leapt in the air and shouted, there were people who were racing over and congratulating others and there were also couples that were in tears (from the disappointment oflosing the draw)."

392: Asked whether it was a fair system of apportioning these new FARMS, he says that if it happened again in 2008, applicants "would probably be advised to get stress counselling"

396: When they moved onto their 550-acre FARM, he says, it had been set up with a freshly decorated HOUSE (consisting ofl ounge, kitchen and three bedrooms), new WOOLSHED, 2000 EWES, 500 HOGGETS and 100 CALVES.

414: Mentions that as settlement continued into the later 1970's, the value of land and STOCK increased so that in order for the SETTLER to service the debt-load (the acreage on offer had to be greater to make it a more economical unit).

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012: States that their level of debt for the FARM totalled $118,000 for the land, buildings, STOCK. Their deposit of $18,300 (or 10%) went towards paying a contribution on both the capital value of land and buildings. The STOCK firm paid for the STOCK— supplied and guaranteed by L&S.

025: Admitting that in the mid-1970s it was a substantial sum to have to find, he says he had managed to save about $12,000 and his FATHER lent the remainder on a "non-interest" basis.

039: Replies that he chose that particular FARM because it appeared to have the best balance between wetland and dryland. He considered it was ideal to have both because the wetter country helped produce a good crop of HAY or SWEDES. But in winter, the drier areas were needed for the SHEEP, especially when there was a long spell of damp weather.

061: Adds that the house was close to the road, which made life easier when the CHILDREN were of school age and they could "race out the front door to catch the bus".

070: Comments that the level of after-settlement support from L&S was "tremendous". The MANAGER (of the LONG VALLEY BLOCK), he recalls, was PHIL DENNY who, along with his wife, MARG "made us feel very, very welcome".

081: As far as the job of FARMING the land, he says they encountered few problems in the immediate years after moving in, although there were a couple of mineral deficiencies so supplements were used in drenches and other applications.

091: Another possible problem was the occurrence of JOHNES' DISEASE (a wasting disease) in SHEEP but, he says, the "rawness of the soils" meant the CLOVERS didn't grow well, later adding that weed GRASSES also quickly crept back.

106: While he admits that it was a difficult area to grow quality PASTURE, he says they overcame this by crop rotation - cultivating SWEDES for a season and alternating those the next season by sowing young GRASSES. It was particularly noticeable, he says, when LAMBS were being fed on the latter as they were bigger and healthier.

117: Considers that the PASTURES are in much better condition than thirty years ago because of the improvements he implemented over that time span.

120: "The trees are all 30m high and the CLOVER is there for nine months of the year.. .and the HAY (and SWEDE) yield is so much better."

123: Recalls that in those first years one of his "killing sheets" recorded 14kg LAMBS and in his astonishment (at the large size) he showed it to one of his neighbours. But in more recent years, he says, it's not unusual to have 19kg or 22 kg weights recorded.

130: The average HAY bale yield, he says was between 3000 and 4000 small bales but when the big round bales were introduced, he says the number was reduced although the actual amount had not. It meant, he adds, having to extend the HAYBARNS so that it could all fit under cover. In terms of good and bad years, he remembers the year the FARMERS had a disagreement with the FREEZING WORKS in the early 1980's because its operators refused to kill the aged EWES. "That finished up with a big demonstration in the streets of INVERCARGILL."

147: Recalls that black and white television was still relatively new, then and so the demonstration was made all the more dramatic because it was televised and he watched some of his neighbours from TE ANAU "racing around, opening trucks and letting old EWES out onto the main street of INVERCARGILL".

152: Ends this recollection with an amusing anecdote about a policeman resorting to handcuffing an old SHEEP to a clothes rack in a high street store after managing to round it up.

157: The average price for a LAMB in 1976, he says, was between $12 and $14 while a couple of years ago it averaged $75. More recently, it has reduced to less than $50.

169: Comments that being one of the 'KAKAPO ROAD' SETTLERS was a surprisingly enjoyable experience. "There was no hierarchy, nobody who thought they were superior to anybody else, we'd all had to work... for other people and we all knew that there was gonna be more work and we were gonna have to do it all ourselves."

181 They were all within the same age group, he continues, and all had young children: "It was one really, really good community." He adds that they created an informal support group in that if one person fell ill, the neighbours rallied round and made sure the children were looked after, or meals were cooked.

188: There were regular anniversaries or birthdays to celebrate: "Everybody just arrived with... something for tea and all the kids and drinks and.. .it went from there.'

208. Replies that the substantial preparation that had already been done on the property prior to settlement made a big difference. The house, buildings, fences and additional materials on site helped cut costs, especially in the first few years when money was tight.

212: The government had a hand in overseeing the SETTLERS budgets (twice a year) which were assessed by both the STOCK AGENCY and a MANAGER. Permission had to be sought when extra money was required by a SETTLER for any additional factors, such as a new building or extension.

222: Is mixed in his response as to how the unsuccessful BALLOT-HOLDERS, some of whom were MANAGERS or workers for L&S, treated the SETTLERS. Says the department often had difficulty holding on to staff who were installed on some of the preBALLOT BLOCKS because, for example, its houses were inadequate for winter conditions.

233: And he admits there may have been difficult exchanges between MANAGERS and SETTLERS although issues were "mostly sorted out over a beer". He later qualified this comment by saying he 'd been referring to a difference of opinion over farming practise that sometimes was voiced between settlers and L&S. Overall, he added, the two groups got on very well together.

243: Considers working in TE ANAU was "totally different" from DARFIELD where often there were well-established families neighbouring a young couple who'd bought into the area. "So there was almost a hierarchy and.. .you didn't feel free to borrow something from them because they really didn't want to lend their toys."

248: Whereas, he says, in TE ANAU there was a fairer exchange in helping each other out.

251: Affirms there was also a big difference in working the land itself because the TE ANAU BASIN is mainly glacial moraine whereas DARFIELD soils are CANTERBURY RIVER PLAINS. "Just so much more fertile and had had so much more done to them."

256: States that when a SETTLER took possession, he was allowed to FREEHOLD the property within seven years at the 'going-in' price. However, these rules changed in the early 1980s.

259: "I siphoned a bit off each year and put it in a separate account and that was to pay off the FREEHOLDING. There was absolutely no way we'd miss that."

270: As part of the 'KAKAPO RD' SETTLERS, he says the first ones to move in at the start of the road made those that followed on from them feel welcome. In addition, he says, the three L&S MANAGERS worked well together and their wives were "top-rate folk".

275: Names them as VINNY & HAZEL de BETTENCOR, PHIL & MARG DENNY and COLIN & MARION DAVENPORT. The latter, he adds, was the local district nurse.

301: Says they tried to keep off the road as much as possible because with it being unsealed, a regular side-effect was a tyre puncture. "And you found that when you went to town you spent money, so you didn't go to town any more than you had to."

317: By the third year of moving onto the FARM, he says, he took up an offer to coach the JUNIOR RUGBY TEAM in TE ANAL]. "That immediately brought me into more contact with the town."

337: On the more recent subdivision of the original FARM BLOCKS, he considers it is all part of the natural evolution of an area with a growing population. "You got individual people that want(ed) to start a lifestyle FARM and it was relatively cheap, at that stage (mid 1980s to mid-2000s) to come and buy some acres here." And even further subdivision evolves from that, he says.

348 States that L&S was slow and reluctant to make small areas available because it wanted the land divided into economical FARM units (a minimum of about 400 acres). Until pressure was applied from the public and it began to release more smaller-sized lots which produced a profitable return.

360: As a FARMER, he says he has to accept this type of land subdivision occurs. And he recalls that particularly when DEER (on smaller-sized lifestyle BLOCKS) became more popular it proved a worthwhile venture in the TE ANAU BASIN.

361: "They were one animal that just thrived up here in TE ANAU." Adds that he didn't get involved in this type of FARMING, although he came within a close call.

370: TE ANAU, he says, has gradually grown on him. "A lot of the wives had to be pleaded with to come into the area. ..and they're still here.. .and the wives now they don't want to leave. It just seems to...it creeps up on you...l think it's the hills and the bush."

380: Interview ends.

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