Archibald [Archie] McDonald

Interviewer: Rebecca Amundsen

Abstracter: Marion Hawkes

First Interview: 23 September 2008

TRACK 1

00:00 Interview Identification

00:44 Archibald Henry McDonald born 19 January 1930

00:56 Interview Agreement

01:40 Born Dunedin [lived in Milton]

01:49 Father was ARCHIBALD HENRY McDONALD – died 26 February 1967 – was a linesman. Mother was GLADYS ELLEN CLARK [sp?] – died 10 November 1984 – no brothers or sisters

02:46 possibly an ancestor that settled in Southland – builder – ARCHIE McDONALD – but not sure what relation he was.

03:07 Ancestors on Mothers side settled in WAITATI – on Fathers side ancestors settled In DUNEDIN. Unsure when ancestors came here. Great Great Grandmother was from SCOTLAND. Grandmothers lived on same farm – two houses. GRANDMA DEAN – describes – GRANDMA CLARK [sp?] lived 100 yards away from each other – married to ARCHIE CLARK [sp?] – who had dairy farm – 30 milking cattle – majority of farm was in grain – oats, barley, wheat – recalls memories and describes grain harvesting – SELF was too small to help – but used to burn gorse – catch rabbits – describes how burnt gorse – helpful job – four cousins used to meet at farm – stay at Christmas and do these activities. First time SELF stayed at farm was about 5 years old – continued to do this until about 9 years old – then holidays changed – this would have been during DEPRESSION

8:06 SELF describes growing up during DEPRESSION. Family was fortunate – Dad had job – got paid 10 shillings a week – could survive on this – things were cheap – one penny for an ice cream – go to picture and theatre once a year and that cost sixpence – if you worked it right you could pay four pence to get into picture and get an ice cream and one penny’s worth of broken biscuits. You could buy bag of broken biscuits in shops for one penny – bag was same size as a small bag of sugar is today – theatre went to was in MILTON. Packet of cigarettes was four pence for ten CAPSTAN cigarettes. Dad used to buy one packet of ten cigarettes a week – SELF used to pick them up for his Dad – prices fluctuated – better brand cigarettes cost about six pence a packet – lesser brands or common brands were about four pence.

10:05 GRANDMA CLARK’S [sp?] first name ETTA [sp?]; GRANDMA DEAN’S first name was MAGGIE – SELF didn’t know GRANNY DEAN’S husband – ARCHIE CLARK [sp?] was GRANDMA CLARK’S [sp?] husband – they had four children – SELF’s Mum – sister and two brothers.

11:03 SELF’s Dad had seven siblings – 2 brothers and 4 sisters. Remembers visiting his DAD’S parents in DUNEDIN – relates and describes where GRANDFATHER lived – house is now student house – house is near UNIVERSITY in DUNEDIN. Grandparents surname was McDONALD – unsure of first names

13:54 SELF relates how he was brought up by his parents – different era – cane was used in school for discipline – then the strap was used – ‘six of the strap’ was easier than ‘six of the cane’ – SELF didn’t get that often. Father was strict and disciplinary to an extent – if Father said ‘be home at 7 o’clock’ you knew to be home otherwise there would be consequences. Mother was more gentle with discipline – if you didn’t ‘play the game’ – you didn’t get the ‘hundreds and thousands’ on your pudding. Parents – particularly men were colder, harder more distant in parenting

15:49 SELF had chores to do at home – be up at 6am on Monday morning – outside – clean the copper bowl – fill with water – get fire going and have water boiling before you went to school. Mother would come out would have stick about 3 foot long, rounded – like handle of rack – she used that to put clothes in boiling water – clothes were boiled in those days - that is how they were cleaned. Other chores will coal and wood – cut the lawns – did the vege garden – had vege garden all his life – father didn’t do any garden ‘didn’t turn one spade of dirt over’ – didn’t like gardening – was 7 years old when producing vegetables. Picked up knowledge as went along – had Chinese man – horse and cart drove down streets and selling cabbages – learned about veges from him. Fresh vegetables were not plentiful in shops. Chinese shopkeepers sold veges and fruit in their shops – these were grown by local Chinese

18:45 SELF relates from point of being only child – did not bother him that had chores he did – being alone – had to make own fun – not others around to play. Taught SELF to be alone – benefits in later life – learned if in charge of something – not so attached – able to make tough decisions. Learned to understand, compromise, forgive and appreciate nature. Relates in comparison to bigger families. Was unusual to be only child at that time – shares observations of changes in family decisions to have children – changes socially – culturally in other countries 22:18 SELF relates being at farm with cousins – found it easy to get on with people – blend in in the background – was able to look from other people’s point of view – relate to how others see things differently – asked questions

23:22 SELF talked about milking at the farm – describes the process – about 30 cows – got machines later on – milk pumped in steel cans – get big draft horse harnessed – go to dairy and put cans on cart and take it about mile to road – and put on stand to be collected. Horse didn’t like children – SELF was only one that horse would co operate with – SELF relates what happened using a gun – about 7 years old – able to shoot rabbits – was allowed 5 bullets – had to shooting by yourself – not allowed in backyard when somebody was away shooting – loved dogs – border collies – was only allowed to take dogs when went shooting - relates situation that occurred when out shooting rabbits with dogs – not a good shot - talks about eye sight – realisation that was blind - sight was only 50 percent – rabbit had to move before he could see – dog could see rabbits – eye sight bad up to two years ago – relates about eye sight operation. Describes process of skinning rabbits – skins dried over fence - sent to STRONACH MORRIS in DUNEDIN – could make fifteen pound if worked hard over holidays – did paper run – got 50 pence.

28:32 SELF went to TOKOMAIRORO DISTRICT HIGH SCHOOL in MILTON – describes original old stone school which has been demolished. Started school at 6 years old – were not allowed to start school until 6 years old. In year SELF started school – Government made change so able to start school at 5 years old – put SELF back one year all his school life. Remembers first day at school – shares details– good memories of school – was a ‘loner’ – Grandmother’s saying - ‘if don’t want to learn even God can’t teach you’ – finished school when 15 years old. Was not allowed to play sports because of glasses – eyes – did play cricket – relates that experience – was able to bowl and catch ball – not good at batting – relates incident with teacher. Played archery – biking – biked for miles – ‘loner’ sports. Could bike 14 miles out to farm and do shooting relates… learned to make arrows

34:02 SELF was 9 years old when WORLD WAR II started describes what it was like – kids didn’t realise full implication of what war was about – shares his understanding of the time – those going to war - wondered if there was propaganda – three Uncles went to war and came back – didn’t talk much about their experiences – one Uncle did share some ‘mild experiences’ – still didn’t seem very nice

37:03 SELF’s father didn’t go to war – was medically unfit – shares about communication – all by telegrams and radio were only source of information – no Television – so didn’t see dramatic pictures of war - couldn’t see and relate to it.

38:17 SELF relates how WAR time affected family life – was about 15 years old - rations – coupons for petrol – only allowed to buy so much sugar – when went to work had to have work permit – shares what would happen if you changed job – all sorts of restrictions – couldn’t just go and do what you wanted to do – shares reasoning behind restrictions –

40:03 started work about 16 or 17 years old – shares getting employment during WAR – worked in menial job in WOOLLEN MILLS MOSGIEL – describes work - didn’t like it - SELF was poor at sewing bales up – had dictatorial boss – describes what happened at work– left the job - jobs were hard to find - would have loved to have job he liked at home so could be with parents -

43:10 SELF left this job and home and got a job as apprentice carpenter was 17 years old. Got job through advertisement – FATHER took him - was a queue for job – spend 5 years in apprenticeship - in MOSGIEL. From there went to work for big construction company in DUNEDIN – went to CHERRY FARM – big mental hospital being built as SEACLIFF MENTAL INSTITUTION was falling into sea due to erosion - worked on first 4 villas there – loved it – patients were shifted into new VILLAS – relates experience. Shifted to Oamaru to PUKEURI [sp?] FREEZING COMPANY to rebuild Freezing Works - was there for three years – then job Building Supervisor Lecturer at LINCOLN COLLEGE – shifted there same time as getting married – house provided with job.

45:33 SELF relates May 1961 – became Field Inspector for the INVERCARGILL CITY COUNCIL Relates how he got job – had three daughters at this time – job interview – shifted - Describes what the job involved – jobs came in over counter - inspecting sold fuel heaters – glass house – house - commercial buildings – although senior building inspector dealt with commercial buildings. Housing – domestic inspections – write up reports – describes the system process. Worked at this for 7 years

48:45 SELF was 32 years old approximately – undertook study – Government position – shares experience – five year course he did in three years – away from kids too much. Was burnt out when he finished – got the qualification – when Senior position came up in INVERCARGILL – had the highest qualification on list of applicants – shares experience. Job title was CHIEF BUILDING INSPECTOR – 1968. SELF shares and describes changes he made in job system how he ran the DEPARTMENT – changed the whole system the way he wanted it – divided TOWN into THREE AREAS objective was to make it work – describes his philosophy – how he treated people. Talks about there being no RED TAPE with getting CONSENT – relates an incident which occurred recently. Suggests changes in legislation – Government interference has made work more complex and over regulated for those working in job now -

58:51 SELF shares when came to INVERCARGILL – just finished up with DREDGE at ISLAND HARBOUR – DREDGE was brought here initially to create ISLAND HARBOUR – which It did – then put into STEAD STREET by JELLICOE SEA SCOUTS – BLUFF side of bridge – Pumped stuff to form new motorway – in order to create by pass round INVERCARGILL for heavy traffic – thinking was ahead of its time – where walkway is now – that was where by pass was going to be. BY PASS was going to go right up back of SHOWGROUNDS – across main road where BP SERVICE STATION is at BRIDGE and then right up through EDINBURGH CRESCENT right through coming out at KARITANE HOME NORTH ROAD – doesn’t know why they didn’t carry it out – possibly change of politicians

1:01:10 SELF talks about TOWN CLERK PETER JONES – [1970s] forward thinking relates potential plans at time –– plan was buying the entire Block of land where KELVIN HOTEL sits on – diagonally across to BANK – turn this into interior shopping complex with no traffic and put a roof over ESK STREET – shares that this planning was very modern. Drawing could very well still be in archives. Shares personal experience with PETER JONES and his opinion that this planning would have made INVERCARGILL different to what it is today. Continues to share potential planning - which included area around the LIBRARY – TRAMCAR across from the LIBRARY – RESTAURANT upstairs at the LIBRARY in NORTH EAST CORNER – COMPUTER TERMINALS in LIBRARY – could pay rates – get library book – get a coffee without going outside – potential covered walkway connecting LIBRARY to other side of street – so people could walk across – go down stairs – not have to walk outside. These plans did not occur because did not want to spend money – explains. Shares how when first came to INVERCARGILL plan was to run WATER from LAKE WAKAPITU to INVERCARGILL to supply water – side branches to everyone that needed water. Talks about possibility – repercussions of this possibility – brilliant ideas

1:07:16 SELF talks about after BROAD SMALLS fire – was involved in demolition - LIBRARY was opened in 1989 – which was built after BROAD SMALLS fire. Talks about ideas of what LIBRARY BUILDING was going to be like – possible underground components – modern thinking. The fire was best contained fire – talked about fire - had potential to get into GRAND HOTEL. BROAD SMALLS was a popular shop

1:09:53 SELF shares 1984 FLOOD – BUILDING INSPECTOR point of view – relates receiving news of FLOOD – had COUNCIL CAR – got up in night – drove down past FLOUR MILL could feel car floating tyres just touching bitumen – went to COUNCIL BASEMENT CIVIL DEFENCE – fielded telephone calls for 48 hours. Describes the storm movement was stationary - rivers were coming up – NIAGARA timber ended up against the BRIDGE QUEENS DRIVE – timber banked diverted the water through WAIKIWI. At same time the stop banks of ORETI collapsed up towards WINTON – water came right down through PIGGERY on BAY ROAD and through to AIRPORT and added to water that was there – couldn’t get out of CITY – couldn’t get in either. Continues to share how supported community. Returned to own job of CHIEF INSPECTOR after the 48 hours – could not do anything – flood went down quick. No text book for how you deal with house that has been under water – called in counterparts from TIMARU south to come and help. SELF had total control of housing – made decision - everything 300 above waterline to be removed – some houses were under 2 metres of water – some under 4 inches up to 1 and 1/2 metres – everything had to go to dump no compromise - continues to share - dealing with Televisions – freezers – fridge – motorcars – bedding – potential sewerage floating round. SELF describes decisions - memorabilia had to go – Insurance Companies objected – had meeting with 25 Insurance Companies prior to Inspections starting. Related meeting up with Insurance agent 20 years later and feedback. Hardest job ever done – making decisions about peoples live and personal affects

1:20:51 SELF shares about waterlines in houses about 900 houses underwater – which meant 4 inches of water to 2 and ½ metres of water in house – linings need to be stripped out – were not allowed to reline until moisture content in framing came down to 21 per cent – thought it should be 18 per cent. Lining was then re gibbed and repainted. There were houses that were demolished – WESTERN end of RENFREW STREET – short street about 6 houses that were gone. Water did not damage roading so much. Talks about people having to have alternative accommodation – sad time – personally did not do well after it was over – had to make decisions – had to live with it – costing people part of their life. Talks about Insurance money. Physical damage was nothing to mental damage to women in particular. Relates a story about flood. Not too many houses that were structurally affected.

1:27:09 Hope future Politicians have got wider vision of what is good for our CITY

1:27:19 End of TRACK 1