Interviewer: Marianne Widmer

Abstracter: Jean Hawkes

JOYCE CARMICHAEL

First Interview: 19 September 2006

TRACK 1

00:00 Sound check – JOYCE ALBERTA CARMICHAEL

00:22 End of Track 1

TRACK 2

00:00 Interview identification

00:32 Born in INVERCARGILL in 1925 Third of five PALMER children – MILDRED – JOHN – Self – ERIC – REG

01:16 Brought up on farm in DIPTON – Re-hab for father from WW1 ORETI RIVER – Mentioned

02:05 [EDUCATION]: Walked 1 ½ miles (2.4ks) each way to DIPTON SCHOOL – First Day – Ice skating on school grounds – Described SOUTHLAND TECHNICAL COLLEGE 3 years

03:51 Raiding of neighbour's orchard – Described Mr McBAIN – Mentioned

04:25 Father had about 16 cows and some sheep – Cream to INVERCARGILL for butter Self milked cows – Always had pet calf – Milking time described AGRICULTURAL DAYS – Mentioned

05:42 When at SOUTHLAND TECHNICAL COLLEGE boarded in SPEY STREET – Train travel

06:33 Father from LONDON, ENGLAND – arrived with immigrants 1911 – worked on farm APARIMA – DIPTON farm after war

07:06 Boarded with war friend of father – Father a signaler – Described MACDONALD & WESTON (Undertakers) – SOMME – Mentioned

08:35 After war father returned to APARIMA – MUIRHEAD'S – Mother lived nearby – Farm at DIPTON – Described 09:21 Self grew up on farm – Never went to INVERCARGILL until secondary school DIPTON – Mentioned

09:49 Assigned to COMMERCIAL course – Boarding 'parents' no children.

10:41 Joined by neighbour's daughter in second year – Self stayed three years. 11:16 Position at NATIONAL MORTGAGE – General office work – Friend (MARGARET) also employed.

12:27 Man-powered to LORNE HOSPITAL as domestic – Matron's suggestion of nursing.

13:30 Sister man-powered to SEACLIFF Psychiatric Hospital (now CHERRY FARM) – Carried on with nursing training – Explained

14:01 Conditions at LORNE HOSPITAL – Described Self there about 2 1/2 years......

15:00 End of Track 2

TRACK 3

00:00 Returned to NATIONAL MORTGAGE.

00:04 Met NOEL while at LORNE HOSPITAL – Dances THORNBURY – RIVERTON – MAKAREWA – Mentioned

00:29 NOEL same class as brother JOHN at TECH

00:40 Duty allocation at LORNE HOSPITAL DULCIE CLARK – H & J SMITH LTD – Mentioned

01:32 Night duty – Dances MAKAREWA HALL INVERCARGILL – WAIKIWI – HAWTHORNDALE – Mentioned

02:38 Transport after dances – Described

04:10 Never thought could be a nurse – KEW Matron's plea not followed up. THORNBURY – MAKAREWA – Mentioned

04:59 NOEL conscripted to farm

05:34 Married 1947

05:48 After LORNE back to NATIONAL MORTGAGE until marriage.

06:00 On farm had 3 bed-roomed house – GUMMIES BUSH (THORNBURY) Mother-in-law died about 1952 – Lady described – Garden – Husband 'The Boss' 07:32 PLUNKET MOTHERS function COLAC BAY – Mentioned Advised of Mrs PALMER'S death

08:05 Father-in-law on his own several years Daily dinner with self and family – Described

09:27 WINSTON in J FORCE – given 150 acres – lived in a hut

10:00 Noel and self about 200 acres – milked cows

10:09 WINSTON – dinner daily except Sunday – Emotional effects of war – described. 11:34 TONY'S comment to UNCLE WINSTON – Following actions – described. GROPERS BUSH – OTAUTAU – Mentioned …...

13:09 Never returned for meals Kindness of people in THORNBURY STORE – Described

14:17 WINSTON admitted to hospital – moved to lifestyle village......

00:02 WINSTON to RIVERTON HOSPITAL

00:11 Self and husband took over all of farm.

00:17 Self – five children – 2 girls – 3 boys – TONY stayed on farm until sold 1970 [SON]: JAMES to university (now in AUCKLAND – Engineering) – School report found MALAYSIA – Mentioned 01:55 [SON]: TONY – BATES TRANSPORT – Did not stay on farm 02:29 [DAUGHTER]: VONNE in LONDON – marriage broke up – returned to AUCKLAND – Health problem – Departmental manager AUCKLAND UNIVERSITY

03:48 [DAUGHTER]: ANN(E) – To LONDON 1980 for 1 year – still there – Phys Ed teacher at JAMES HARGEST HIGH SCHOOL – Accident on motorcycle – Described – Teaching difficult students – Friend of principal of GIRLS' HIGH INVERCARGILL – DUNEDIN – WAIANIWA – Mentioned

08:00 ANN plans to return to NZ in a couple of years – Job and house waiting. Good cook – Not a good housekeeper

08:26 Self visited (Ann) several times – ANN never married

09:04 [INVOLVEMENT]: PLUNKET SOCIETY – KARITANE HOSPITAL BOARD – THORNBURY HOME and SCHOOL ASSOCIATION – RIVERTON and DISTRICTS BATHS COMMITTEE – RIVERTON LADIES GOLF CLUB – THORNBURY ANGLICAN CHURCH [ST LEONARD'S] – RIVERTON ANGLICAN PARISH – SYNODS PERSON ANGLICAN CHURCH – COGS COMMITTEE (Community Organisation Grants Scheme) – JUDGING SHAREMILKER of the YEAR in SOUTHLAND – SOUTHLAND REGIONAL COUNCIL – SOUTHLAND PROVINCIAL WDFF (Women's Division Federation Farmers – now Rural Women NZ) – VARIOUS WDFF COMMITTEES – NZ HOLSTEIN-FRIESIAN ASSOCIATION (various sections including judging) – FETA COMMITTEE (Farmers Education Training Association previously as Farm Cadets)

12:18 All involvement was voluntary

12:26 Received National Bank 1993 WOMEN'S SUFFRAGE AWARD – Social evening

12:47 RIVERTON SENIOR CITIZENS Many positions as Secretary and/or Treasurer

13:20 No longer holding books (for organisations) – Group interests change from farm activities.

14:30 Bred pedigree Holstein-Friesian cattle – Noel's father's stock – Stud registered 1929......

15:00 End of Track 4

TRACK 5

00:02 Bought some of home farm – Piece by piece bought it all – WINSTON 150 acres – Self about 300 acres

00:21 Loved cows – 6-bail walk-through shed – Built second rotary shed in SOUTHLAND (28 bails)

00:47 Day started 5.00am – planning of time explained.

01:15 Appointment to HOLSTEIN-FRIESIAN BREEDING COMMITTEE – Explained First woman to be appointed – Husband would not take part in any committees except RUGBY.

01:55 NOEL coached young rugby players

02:07 No problems as sole woman on committee – Visited SOUTHLAND breeders Husband helpful

03:00 NOEL'S tractor accident (arm injury) – Described TONY – Mentioned

04:33 While NOEL in hospital had daily help on farm – sometimes a married couple

04:46 Moved into big old house – 10 in CARMICHAEL family (6 girls, 4 boys) Living conditions – described.

05:17 Had wonderful life – Husband's adoration – Ability to discuss problems

05:51 1992 bought house in RIVERTON – TONY on farm – JOHN farm at NIGHTCAPS – JAMES at university or MALAYSIA.

06:18 TONY sold farm in 1993 – not interested in stock.

06:27 Earlier had Farm Cadets on property – explained Several have own farms.

07:10 HOLSTEIN-FRIESIAN COMMITTEE – 9 years – Counsellor for OTAGO- SOUTHLAND – Overseas Tours EUROPE – ENGLAND – NORTHERN IRELAND – SCOTLAND – GERMANY – Mentioned

08:06 Fantastic time – Visited farms and homes

08:23 HUNGARY – stock wintered in sheds – Hospitality remembered

09:08 FRANCE – Southern French more friendly than northern. NOEL enjoyed trips but would not get up to speak – Self needed his support

10:14 Discussion one-on-one most helpful.

10:38 To RIVERTON in 1992 – Trip to AUSTRALIA – AMERICA – CANADA – AFRICA.

11:15 Events immediately prior to NOEL passing away in his sleep.

13:01 Passing was a shock – Happier memories than if he had been ill. A lot to be thankful for – Last words spoken to him

14:23 [WDFF}: …...

TRACK 6

00:12 [WDFF]: Womens Division Federated Farmers now Rural Women NZ – Reasons for formation and activities – Explained

01:13 Dressmaking Courses – Described

02:20 Own involvement in WDFF – THORNBURY Branch – Provincial meetings – INVERCARGILL meetings

04:19 [WDFF]: Western Southland – Southland – Eastern – Young people not interested

04:39 YOUNG FARMERS – Mentioned

04:44 Membership of THORNBURY WDFF – Self still attends as Life Member.

05:13 Attended church at THORNBURY until it closed about 2002 – now attend RIVERTON.

05:36 Self still member RURAL WOMEN – Life member – Means of contact with others – Meetings described 06:20 Self overseas many times – Refused to talk about trips (reasons given) EUROPE – Mentioned Sistine Chapel – Unable to describe it GERMANY – MUNICH – Mentioned

08:00 [HOLSTEIN-FRIESIAN TOURS]: Talk given at BALCLUTHA – Described.

08:28 Trip to ENGLAND with friend – Tour with own daughter SCOTLAND – LANDS END – Mentioned

09:07 DURHAM CATHEDRAL

09:16 [RURAL WOMEN]: NOELINE FRASER – WINNIE LIVINGSTON – Mentioned Members more than 50 years – New ones arriving in district

10:10 Ways changing – 'Old habits die hard'

10:41 Monthly meetings (Thornbury) – Executive in INVERCARGILL alternate months

11:16 [ACTIVITIES]: Babies singlets

11:52 (WDFF) Only social occasion – THORNBURY HALL built about 1960 now very little used

12:19 Grocery shop in THORNBURY closed – Service in earlier times described.

12:44 Comments by interviewer

12:52 New THORNBURY CHURCH – Built 1970s – Reasons for closing explained Three local priests in RIVERTON – Fully ordained

14:08 Small Anglican congregations Changes to modes of transport over the years

14:51 Judging schools for cattle – Shows – Mentioned

15:00 End of Track 6

TRACK 7

00:00 Self still judges at FRIESIAN shows – Life member – Kept up-to-date with news 'Use by Date' over 80 years or attitude

01:34 End of Track 7

Second Interview: 6 December 2006

00:00 Interview Identification

00:27 Recap of last part 1 of interview. Details.

01:02 Overview of this interview. Anglican Church, Homefront

01:19 Father Londoner married – lived in DIPTON, whole family going to Anglican church. Describes. Reference: DIPTON

02:20 size of church community. Vicar from LUMSDEN, serves large area. Explains. Comparing to today. Fortnightly in each church. Reference: LUMSDEN

03:25 Dressing up for church. Explains. Situation in 1920's. No shoes. “Hard up”. Describes.

04:38 How going to Sunday School, walking. To church, Horse and Cart.

05:16 Age for taking communion. Confirmation. Explains. Compares to today. Comparing to Catholic church. Details.

06:20 Sunday School at age 5. Details. Teacher wages. Details. Poor wages for Vicar. Details.

08:15 When married Anglican church in THORNBURY. Husband NOEL not Anglican. Got baptised with oldest daughters communion. Self appreciated very much. Religion of own children now. Details. Reference: ST. LEONARDS THORNBURY; ST JOHNS INVERCARGILL

09:53 Involvement in church committee THORNBURY after married. Treasurer. Capable of doing job. Thornbury area community. Area of services for Vicar, number of services. Details.

12:05 Committee member, then treasurer. For THORNBURY, then district. Until this year! Looking up notes. Secretary. Hard to remember. Different areas.

14:50 Building of new church THORNBURY. Open only few years, as people moving out of area. Details. Reference: MRS LIN FOSTER, FOSTER FAMILY.



17:25 Looking up records, 1970's rebuilding of church. Fundraising, voluntary work. Details. Reason for rebuilding of church, “worn out”. Bell Tower, bell from a boat in new church. Reusing parts of old church.

20:38 Closing service of church in 2002. Reason for closure. Explains. Running of church in “those days”. Details.

23:30 Aside: still going to Rural Women Thornbury.

25:15 Advisory member of church still now. Aside: baptised when 3 weeks old.

27:15 Churches in Parish today. Reference: RIVERTON; TUATAPERE; THORNBURY; OTAUTAU; OREPUKI

28:40 Aside: Otago Rail Trail recently. No Church service. Feeling deprived.

29:20 Husband NOEL on Homefront. “Chip in shoulder” for rest of life. Sad. Reason: “Stay home and work on the farm”. Brother Winston in J-FORCE later. Reference to first interview. Not many that stayed back. Played rugby through war. No other meetings.

32:43 noise: Doorbell

32:50 Continuing. War over, still embarrassed. Never discussed much. He felt neglected duty.

34:10 One brother didn't come back from war. Explains. NOEL complex about not joining war. Describes. Very happy married life. Describes.

35:30 “He just forgot to wake up one morning”

35:40 Communication with people in Europe. Explains. Air raid shelters in LONDON. Feeling secure in NEW ZEALAND. Explains.

37:10 Moving to Riverton, reasons. Explains. Neighbours at Verdun Street. Describes. Reference: VERDUN STREET, RIVERTON

38:50 Thanks for Interview.