Norma Shave (née Rhind)

Interviewers: Rangimaria Suddaby and Shona Fordyce

Abstracter: Laura Davies

First Interview: 24 May 2012

TRACK 1

00:00 Interview Details

01:21 NORMA IRENE ANNETTA SHAVE, born in 1915 in INVERCARGILL

01:45 Interview legal requirements

02:30 Notes SHONA FORDYCE, friend of NORMA SHAVE will be asking most of the questions

03:00 Started at MAKAREWA SCHOOL - transferred to WALLACETOWN SCHOOL when her youngest brother a sister started school – mother died when they were young – attended WALLACETOWN SCHOOL then to INVERCARGILL SECONDARY SCHOOL

03:50 Applied for job at the UNDERWOOD MILK FACTORY where her father worked.

04:00 Awarded SCHOLARSHIP at school – her twin sister took the job at the UNDERWOOD MILK FACTORY

04:45 Left school during the depression and struggled to find employment – saw advertisement for work at THORNBURY FARM

05:20 Worked at THORNBURY FARM as a HOUSEKEEPER for three bachelor farmers- NORMA was 17 or 18 at the time – her father disagreed with her taking the job - did household chores – describes the farmers as like brothers – Describes

07:00 Recalls times she went FLY-FISHING and caught a large fish and sent it to her grandmother in MAKAREWA – Describes

9:30 DANCES - went to dances at WALLACETOWN - Every Saturday night they would all go to the pictures - Describes

10:20 Grew vegetables - potatoes and other vegetables - also made room for a flower garden – JOCK TURNBULL[?] asked her father came to look at the farm.

12:25 Learnt to drive - drove to get her license in Thornbury – DRIVING TEST - Describes.

15:00 END OF TRACK 1

TRACK 2

00:00 DRIVING LICENSE TEST – continued – Recalls story about driving to nearby farm.

2:05 JOCK TURNBULL - The TURNBULL FARM at THORNBURY

02:16 Fathers name was FRANK RHIND

02:30 Recalls story about falling from a tree at 12 years old and going to the hospital where she decided to become a NURSE.

3:30 Her father (FRANK RHIND) had five sisters - one married - the rest were all NURSES. One was a maternity nurse the others were general nurses with two going to the FIRST WORLD WAR - RUTH RHIND and ELLIS RHIND - names on WALLACETOWN or MAKAREWA Placard.

04:15 Recalls story of putting her name down for NURSING to the MATRON at KEW HOSPITAL – mentions her father having to raise five children and not wanting to burden him – approximately 20-21 when she began her training – Describes

07:20 KEW HOSPITAL opened around 1937 – Lived at the nurses home at KEW HOSPITAL

07: 35 Account for the FIRE AT KEW HOSPITAL – 1 August 1938/39(?) – on duty in the Women’s Surgical Ward - evacuating patients – Children’s Ward - Reported to a DR HUNTER – Describes

15:00 END OF TRACK 2

TRACK 3

00:00 FIRE AT KEW HOSPITAL – continued - the middle section burst into flames. Four or five feet high. Coming out along the sides – Describes

01:30 Recalls that the fire originated in the attic used for the storage and the wireless - Operating theatre below attic – had to remove the ether to stop explosion –Describes

03:25 Recalls DOMESTIC STAFF helped evacuate patients – lots of individuals came to help – Describes

04:45 Went to DEE STREET to help with evacuation – patients sent to RIVERTON – had to evacuate the patients at Riverton – Describes

05:40 DR HUNTER, building in LORNE, SOUTHLAND repurposed to house patents – had to be cleaned – windows fixed – bales of hay – Describes

9:08 No injuries from the FIRE at KEW HOSPITAL

9:44 END OF TRACK 3

TRACK 4

00:00 [tape starts half-way through a recollection] – Norma Shave talks about birth of still born set of twins – Order of children of SIBLINGS: Older brother, twin girls (her and sister BERYL), still born son, another set of twins (JOYCE WALDREN, BLUFF and JACK RHIND)

1:13 JACK RHIND’s eldest daughter had twin girls and his youngest daughter and girl and boy twins

1:39 The mother of NORMA SHAVE had four sisters – twins – MARGARET HARPER – MARION WALDREN

2:55 Recalls GRANDPARENTS – mother’s father died of a stroke in his 60s, grandmother died when she was 89 – On her father’s side her grandfather died in his late 70s, grandmother in her 80s – Describes

03:45 Her SISTER in BLUFF and her the only ones to reach her 90s – her sister will be 92 on the 18th of June.

04:15 Paternal family (RHIND), born in SCOTLAND. Maternal family (FOTHERINGHAM), possible born NEW ZEALAND

05:05 1950 decided to travel to LONDON – going to live in NURSES HOME - disagreed with Father over travel plans – Describes

06:50 Worked at the ROYAL MASONIC HOSPITAL in HAMMERSMITH – Private hospital that turned into a training school – had job for three months – worked with other NEW ZEALAND NURSES – Describes

08:05 CHANNEL ISLANDS with CAPTAIN TROUT – JERSEY, GUERNSEY and SARK – Describes

13:00 View of white cliffs of DOVER – Describes

13:15 Worked in a Hospital in LONDON – then HITCHHIKED around CORNWALL and DEVON – MERSEY TUNNELS – Describes

15:00 END OF TRACK 4

TRACK 5

00:00 HITCHHIKING around England – continued – MERSEY TUNNELS – LIVERPOOL – SALVATION ARMY – POLICE STATION – Describes

03:44 Went to Scotland and worked in the THORACIC UNIT – heart operations – was allowed to go watch the operations – called SISTER even though she was only a NURSE – Describes

05:40 Recalls a story where she used her experience to say something was wrong with a patient – had to push the issue

07:55 Recalls another story of a patient that had had an abdominal operation – used knowledge she had learnt in KEW HOSPITAL

11:00 Was asked to stay on longer than the three months at the hospital – MR LOGAN, Surgeon in the THORACIC UNIT – had stayed in BRITAIN for almost four years – Describes

13:00 Was given six months leave to visit family, then got MARRIED and did not return – Describes

13:30 Recalls trips around SCOTLAND – got ten days leave on full pay

15:00 END OF TRACK 5

TRACK 6

00:00 Returned to NEW ZEALAND -Recalls meeting her husband – TOM SHAVE - during fireworks at her Father’s place – Describes

00:53 Believed she was never going to get MARRIED – her sister was a MRS LAINCHBURY[?]

1:45 Got MARRIED in January or February – cannot remember date

02:11 TOM SHAVE was brother’s wife’s uncle – No children –NORMA SHAVE was 40 when she married – MARRIED for 20 years – Describes

03:35 Describes EXTENDED FAMILY, children of her siblings - MRS BARLOW – First registered accountant – CANADA – INDIA – Describes

06:13 Recalls nine journeys over to CANADA – continues description of extended family members - POLAND – AUSTRIA – Describes

07:22 SHONA FORDICE recounts a women in CHARLES STREET – mentions – Dr RHIND – DR BAILEY – CHARLES STREET – MRS LOWE, TOM SHAVE’s sister

9:25 NORMA SHAVE compares traveling by ship and aeroplane – Recalls her SHIP TRAVEL TO ENGLAND – Describes

11:15 Shopping in THORNBURY – vegetables and mutton – time in THORNBURY – Describes

12:03 RETIREMENT – helped care for her brother surgery - DUNEDIN -sister-in-law-DOROTHY RHIND – radium burn – both came to stay with NORMA SHAVE – Describes

15:00 END OF TRACK 6

TRACK 7

00:00 Story about her brother and DOROTHY (DOT) RHIND – continued – very close with her sister-in-law - Describes

02:52 END OF TRACK 6

Second Interview: 3 July 2012

TRACK 1

00:00 Interview Details

01:02 NORMA IRENE ANETTA SHAVE (nee RHIND) born 11 January 1915

1:23 Interview Agreement

02:15 NURSING days - uniform – cap - white shoes and stockings – Details

02:54 Hours worked - seven days a week – days irregular – Details

03:40 – MATRON ROSS

04:40 Memories of DR HUNTER – MRS HUNTER – child MARY HUNTER was CEO HOSPITAL – SHONA FORDICE talks about the HUNTER house

06:03 Cottage NORMA SHAVE lived in cottage when worked as a NURSE – babysitting DR HUNTER’S children – HUNTER RACEHORSE – Describes

08:10 SHONA FORDICE recalls the change of NURSING UNIFORM – pay to use uniform – bows – MATRON BUCHANAN – NORMA SHAVE recalls uniform – Details

10:00 CHRISTMAS and the HOSPITAL – singing CAROLS through the hospital – Describes

11:00 SHONA FORIDCE explains the churches coming into the Hospital during CHRISTMAS – Describes

11:55 STAFF NURSE – reported to DR HUNTER – patient BUCHANAN – also a patent in LONDON – Describes

15:00 END OF TRACK 1

TRACK 2 00:00 Continued story of BUCHANAN

00:21 Worked as a STAFF NURSE in the DIET KITCHEN – supplied supper to MATRON when she was entertaining guests – Recalls story about making a passionfruit sponge cake – Describes

02:20 SHONA FORDICE recalls her first MATRON Miss LUCAS – NORMA SHAVE remembers LUCAS – in LORNE – MATRON Miss PORTIAS[?] of RIVERTON – Describes

03:15 Leave allowance and HOURS when working as a NURSE – in by ten, one late night a week – working hours –Details

06:02 Days off – NORMA SHAVE spent her days off going home – father worked at UNDERWOOD MILK FACTORY – grew-up in the FACTORY HOUSE

06:40 Mentions her MOTHER passing – FATHER worked nightshift – did not always have a HOUSEKEEPER – made pillow forts – Describes

08:45 Recalls taking the HORSE AND GIG from the HOSPITAL to her house– Describes

10:20 Recalls HORSE-RIDING – MILK FARMING – driving truck over for food – Describes

12:33 WAGES earned while NURSING – wage increases – Details

15:00 END OF TRACK 2

TRACK 3

00:00 WAGES while NURSING – continued – PRIME MINISTER PETER FRASER was approached about low page for NURSES – board deducted from wages – Details

01:34 Meals and boarding at the NURSING ACCOMODATION – own room – furniture provided – MATRON check – room inspections - Details

04:55 Recalls having WAGES stolen from her bag from accommodation – H AND J SMITH - Describes

06:55 Recalls saving money and putting in the SOUTHLAND BUILDING SOCIETY – returned from overseas – worked at LORNE and wanted to purchase a car – brother JAMES RHIND, GORE loaned her money for her first CAR – Describes

08:33 JAMES RHIND – single – served in WWII then moved to GORE – Story about family friends (Mr ADAMS and MRS ADAMS) trying to visit JAMES RHIND in GORE HOSPITAL – also sent to KEW HOSPITAL – DR FERNANDO – Describes

15:00 END OF TRACK 3

TRACK 4 00:00 Continuation from TRACK 3

00:28 WORLD WAR II – 1939 first year of training – 1939 they started getting wounded soldiers – soon had stretched up the Men’s wards due to overpopulation – RETURNED SOLDIERS – Details

02:00 Recalled story about solider wanting leave escaped out the window

02:45 When WORLD WAR II ended – CELEBRATIONS by the soldiers still in the wards – Describes

05:15 Celebrations in INVERCARGILL at the end of WORLD WAR II - crowded – greeting soldiers off the train – Describes

06:51 Rations during WORLD WAR II – mentions rations still happening when she lived overseas in the 1950s – food was provided to the NURSES – Describes

08:52 Located in GREYMOUTH, doing maternity training towards the end of the war – Describes

09:52 Had brother-in-law that was a diviner - Mentions that she is psychic – she predicted end of the WORLD WAR II – INNES RHIND – predicted delivery of a woman while she worked on maternity ward – Describes

14:00 Begins story of MRS BARLOW, WEST PLAINS ROAD was Pregnant – ST STEPHEN'S CHURCH – Mentions twin sister BERYL – would go over on Sunday – Describes

15:00 END OF TRACK 4

TRACK 5

00:00 Continuation of story of MRS ELWYN BARLOW – predicted the birth of her twin girls – Describes

03:13 SANDRA RHIND had twins - lots of twins in her family - Her mother died in childbirth of – family bible showed thirteen sets of twins - Describes

05:40 Satisfaction from NURSING for NORMA SHAVE

06:24 Recollections from SHONA FORDICE of being a NURSE – travelling – Describes

07:12 1950 – 1953 NORMA SHAVE went travelling – Repeats story of her father trying to talk her out of travel – originally was only to go for a year –Describes

09:13 Worked at the MASONIC HOSPITAL – CHANNEL ISLANDS – worked in London – waited until the coronation was over – hitchhiked – went to EDINBURUGH - worked at the THORACIC UNIT in hospital in LEITH – DR LOGAN – Describes

12:00 BUS TRIP TO THE CONTINENT – travelled around SCOTLAND – had to take leave from Hospital, 10 day trip – Describes

14:11 Recalls story about leaving and returning to NEW ZEALAND

15:00 END OF TRACK 5

TRACK 6 00:00 Continuation of story – DR LOGAN of LEITH told NORMA SHAVE he wished he could have his hospital staffed with New Zealand nurses - SHONA FORDICE mentions AUSTRALIA AND NEW ZEALAND nurses are well respected overseas – Describes

03:20 Recalls being on ‘special’ patients that came from theatre, repeats story about identifying patient that had stroke – Describes

05:55 [Interruption due to visitor]

06:22 END OF TRACK 6